28 August 2017

Socialism vs. capitalism


Via the Latestagecapitalism subreddit.  (yes, I know there's an "of" missing in the text)

16 comments:

  1. Jesus, is this us now? A disaster of epic proportions with huge human suffering, and the first thing that comes to mind is smarmy Facebook quips?

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    1. A disaster in part due to man made climate change, which experts (called... "scientists") long predicted would increase the size and ferocity of such storms. And why are you so defensive about the term "socialism?" Public schools, highways, fire and police departments are socialism in action. It is exactly what you are seeing now as human beings help each other out- without regard to cost or profit. Do you have a problem with calling it what it is- is this us now?

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    2. You're using a humanitarian disaster to misrepresent an ideology that's killed tens of millions. It's gross.

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    3. Funny, I could accuse you of the same thing- and presenting it without any supporting evidence whatsoever. I could also accuse you of ignoring and denying the severity of this disaster long before it occurred as it was well predicted by climate scientists due to the fact of man made climate change- and of many more extremely severe storms yet to come made all the more lethal due to same said reason:

      http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2013/13/130215-severe-storm-climate-change-weather-science/

      https://earthobservatory.nasa.gov/Features/ClimateStorms/page2.php

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  2. Of course, the solution to providing safety was detailed after Ike.
    http://www.tamug.edu/ikedike/
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ike_Dike

    It would cost 3-4 billion. Naturally, that's too much for Texans to be taxed for.

    Similarly, protecting New York City would cost about 20-25 billion.

    https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2017/06/15/world/europe/climate-change-rotterdam.html

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  3. Seems to me that socialism is forced charity, and that's not what's going on here.

    FEMA, the US Coast Guard the US National Guard, the local police and fire departments and others are emergency response operations, more akin to insurance than charity. On the other hand, look at all the charity that is being poured in, voluntarily.

    Capitalism will rebuild Houston. Watch.

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    1. Oh, good lord, man! What sort of "insurance" is this that everyone pays for, but is only used by those in need?

      Capitalism will not rebuild Houston. It didn't rebuild New Orleans. It didn't rebuild the Jersey Shore or Staten Island. Flood insurance may have rebuild houses, but infrastructure was government money -local and fed. Most of it paid by people who may never set foot in those places

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    2. BS- Platoni is basically correct- our tax monies go towards the upkeep and common good of so much of our basic, everyday infrastructure, first responders and emergency "social" services.

      Of course, you and the others who so strongly abhor the basic tenets of "socialism" can all set a very strong example by denouncing and refusing to use: our public schools, libraries, parks, roadways and highways. You can also refuse fire and medical service from local fire departments, and hire your own police force and judiciary.

      Oh, and giving up all claims to your Socialist Social Security and Medicare would really send a strong signal...

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    3. socialism is forced charity

      Ehm. No. It's democratically deciding that some bills are mandatorily shared by all because indirectly we all share the benefits. The fact that taxes are not paid voluntarily or arbitrarily, make them not a charity.

      Capitalism will rebuild Houston. Watch.

      No, it won't. Just like it didn't rebuild New Orleans, the Jersey shore or any other place hit by a natural disaster.

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  4. Everyone, there is a spectrum from ultra-capitalist to ultra-statist. Essentially no one alive believes in either extreme. All right-wingers believe that certain things should be handled by the state, just as all left-wingers believe that some amount of free market is necessary. No right-wingers want Somalia, and no left-wingers want North Korea. We can quibble over where on the spectrum in between we want society to be -- a little more or less state involvement here or there -- but these must be quantitative discussions about details, not broad qualitative ones.

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  5. Capitalism says this. If you're dumb enough to build or live in a flood plain without concrete pilings/stilts and/or flood insurance, then your money is gone and you have to live somewhere cheaper and safer.

    I live in a wildfire prone area. I can choose whether or not to buy home insurance. If I choose not to, that is my risk. If a fire happens, I can not plead "I had no idea...now give me free stuff to make up for my ignorance and stupidity..better yet...give me a free house or RV or single wide trailer". OR I can buy insurance...or move away from a wildfire prone area. Those are capitalist choices. It's called PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY FOR MY CHOICES AND ACTIONS.

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    1. Socialism does not advocate the abolition of personal responsibility, nor does it promote building your home in a drainage ditch. It merely acknowledges that society, people contributing and working together for a common good can accomplish a lot more than one person working alone.

      It also goes a long way towards preventing belief in megalomaniacs making delusional boasts such as, "I alone can fix it!"

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  6. Socialism kept a swift water rescue team from my town (outside of Baltimore, MD) sitting in San Antonio for 4 days, waiting for a directive to go to the Houston area to assist with the rescue efforts. The free market allowed dozens of people in the "Cajun Navy" to put their boats in the flood waters and rescue hundreds of people from rooftops and flooded structures.

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    1. I didn't know that the free in free market stood for working for free.

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    2. Kolo, I don't understand how volunteers in the Cajun Navy can be cited as examples of free market capitalism rather than socialism. ??

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